Subject: Re: Peri-OT: Mars Inc
"I'm curious. Does "lost their way" represent a forward looking judgment?"

Kind of neither...more of a moral judgement on my part.

I'm not an ESG advocate, even in its (largely hypothetical) ideal form. And, to borrow a phrase, I understand that capitalism ain't beanbag.

But, given the choice, I would prefer companies I invest in to have some evidence of a moral compass. And when patient care is part of the business, it's an imperative.

For literally generations, JNJ was a profitable solid, ethical company. It made sterile dressings, band-aids, home nostrums, sickbed/ personal hygiene/baby supplies.

From its credo: "We believe our first responsibility is to the patients, doctors and nurses, to mothers and fathers and all others who use our products and services. In meeting their needs everything we do must be of high quality...We must provide highly capable leaders and their actions must be just and ethical.

It walked the talk in 1982, with the enormous, unprecedented Tylenol recall (briefly: a still-unknown deranged person put cyanide in Tylenol capsules in the Chicago area - this being in the pre-secure packaging days. Several died. JNJ immediately, voluntarily recalled every bottle everywhere at a cost of millions. It preserved the brand, and is still taught as an example of executive management in a business crisis)

But over the last couple of decades (quotes lifted directly from Wikipedia, but I remember hearing about most contemporaneously) :

-- "In 2010 a group of shareholders sued the board for allegedly failing to take action to prevent serious failings and illegalities since the 1990s, including manufacturing problems, bribing officials, covering up adverse effects and misleading marketing for unapproved uses".

-- Also "in 2010, J&J were warned by the FDA to not promote Risperdal as effective and safe for elderly patients, but they did so, and that they paid Omnicare to promote the drug to care home physicians...The settlement was finalized on November 4, 2013, with J&J agreeing to pay a penalty of around $2.2 billion"

-- "In 2011, J&J settled litigation brought by the US Securities and Exchange Commission under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act and paid around $70M in disgorgement and fines. J&J's employees had given kickbacks and bribes to doctors in Greece, Poland, and Romania to obtain business selling drugs and medical devices and had bribed officials in Iraq to win contracts under the Oil for Food program"

-- "In 2019...class action alleged that Johnson & Johnson, which "aggressively marketed" the [vaginal mesh] implants "failed to properly warn patients and surgeons of the risk, or test the devices adequately". Emails between executives show the company was aware of the risks in 2005 but still went ahead and made the product available." In November 2019 the Federal Court of Australia found Johnson & Johnson negligent"

Then there's talcum powder (science debatable, but it's apparently factual that known asbestos contamination of the talc was deliberately concealed by JNJ); the years'-long failure of a JNJ subsidiary to delay recalling a clearly flawed hip implant; various courts' finding of complicity in the whole opioid mess; nontrivial patent infringements scattered over the last few decades.

That's why I claim JNJ has "lost their way".

Again: no company's perfect, and this whole argument can degenerate into whataboutism in a nanosecond.

But overall, I prefer associating with people who wake up with a sense of duty, and follow it - say, Clinton Coolidge over Andrew Johnson; Col Vinman over Col Kurtz; Starfleet over Ferengi; Jimmy Stewart over John Wayne; Elizabeth II over George IV; Costco over WalMart.

--sutton