1. If the democrats raise taxes like that, they're donezo in the next election.

As in, historically. Therefore...they won't ever do it. Your premise dies right there.

Except....if the democrats cut Social Security and Medicare like you suggest they will, then they're donezo in the next election.

As in, historically. Therefore...they won't ever do it. So your premise dies right there.

So once we are in the situation where the Democrats (or the Republicans) have to choose between one or the other, which do they choose? What makes you think that the Democrats would choose to cut SS and Medicare, rather than raise taxes?

Yes it is this discussion. You're the one who keeps explicitly taking reform or efficiency and everything else off the table.

You've said like 4 times "we're not doing that. We're just not".

I'm not taking them off the table, any more than you're taking tax cuts off the table. I'm just pointing out that benefit cuts will never get chosen. They can be on the table all you want, but they'll never get through Congress. Given a choice between cutting Social Security and Medicare, or anything else (including tax increases), Congress is going to choose the "anything else."

You seem to think that there's a likelihood that Congress would be willing to cut Social Security and Medicare rather than increase taxes. I don't think that would ever happen. I'm not arguing that the current situation is good, or that no one should talk about spending cuts. Just that spending cuts will not happen, because Congress will never choose the spending cuts over the tax increases.

No, homie. You ruled out any possibility of a change several times before. Now we're driving with your position and seeing how fast and how hard it smacks into a stone wall -and- seeing how far all the parts fly away from the wreck.

What do you think would happen with your position, when it smacks into a stone wall -and- see how far the parts fly away from the wreck? What do you think happens to the U.S. economy, and the U.S. health care system specifically, if you cut Social Security and Medicare by 20% across the board?

Neither of those scenarios is good. That's not what I disagree with you on. What I disagree with you is the idea that Congress would actually choose the Medicare/SS cuts, rather than the tax increases.