Hi, Shrewd!        Login  
Shrewd'm.com 
A merry & shrewd investing community
Best Of PoliticsBest OfAll BoardsThe Shrewd’m WeeklyLearn to InvestHow to Become Shrewd
Search
Shrewd'm.com Merry shrewd investors
Search
Best Of PoliticsBest OfAll BoardsThe Shrewd’m WeeklyLearn to InvestHow to Become Shrewd


The week's question
In December 2024, in the thread "Re: BRK: Why Not XOM?", BreckHutHigh asked the members: "What about the long road trips with kids?" This week it is put to everyone again. The button below opens the small thread re-asking it - read what others have said so far, then give your own answer as an ordinary reply.
Answer this questionContinue to Shrewd'mThis note won't appear again
Halls of Shrewd'm / US Policy
Unthreaded | Threaded | Whole Thread (19) |
Author: albaby1 SILVER
SHREWD
  😊 😞

Number: of 84346 
Subject: Re: Trump and 14th Amendment
Date: 09/15/23 9:26 AM
Post New | Post Reply | Report Post | Recommend It!
No. of Recommendations: 5
The 14th amendment has barred some people from office. None of these people were convicted of insurrection.

Sure - but different people did different things on January 6th, with different legal consequences. That's why some members of the Proud Boys were convicted of sedition, while Trump hasn't even been charged with it. There's a difference between overtly and directly planning violent physical activity against government officials, and engaging in a conspiracy for election fraud. The former fits far, far more easily into the basked of "insurrection" than the latter.

There is a different level of evidence required. A criminal conviction requires "beyond doubt". A civil action like the 14th amendment has a lower requirement of 'preponderance of the evidence' (i.e. that it is more likely than not).

Which is true, but not a great argument in support of no evidence required. The claim being made is that the 14th is self-executing. That there doesn't need to be any hearing or court determination or process whatsoever by which evidence is presented and evaluated by a judge, whether in a civil or criminal proceeding. That a member of elections department staff can decide to disqualify Trump from the ballot based on what they've seen on the news and in the papers, and without any requirement to give Trump an opportunity to present evidence or argument.

It's really hard to see judges - who generally place great importance on process and an opportunity to be heard - going along with that idea.
Post New | Post Reply | Report Post | Recommend It!
Print the post
Members reply directly to albaby1 here — and replies get answered. Reading is free; so is joining the conversation. Join Shrewd'm »
This community has written 84,309 posts about US Policy. The article-length ones it recommended most:
It's going to get worse · 33 recs · 2025
G’day Donny · 30 recs · 2026
Old Related Story · 28 recs · 2026
HCR is a national treasure · 27 recs · 2025
Fascism in America · 27 recs · 2025
Unthreaded | Threaded | Whole Thread (19) |


Announcements
US Policy FAQ
Contact Shrewd'm
Contact the developer of these message boards.

Best Of Politics | Best Of | Favourites & Replies | All Boards | Followed Shrewds | Open Questions | Moving a community