Avoid making negative or unhelpful posts, and instead focus on providing constructive feedback and ideas that can help to move the discussion forward.
- Manlobbi
Halls of Shrewd'm / US Policy❤
No. of Recommendations: 17
The comfortable liberal assumption is that this is an information problem. If we just fact-check harder, teach media literacy, or find the right messenger, people will come around to reality.
This is delusional.
These Americans aren't confused. They've chosen a story that feels true over facts that don't. Everyone has access to the same internet. The FBI crime statistics, deficit numbers, vote counts, death rates, Trump's actual business history, his documented lies, it's all right there. But millions have decided that all of this is fake while anonymous posts about microchips in your flu shot and Trump's secret genius reveal hidden truths.
You can't educate people out of beliefs they didn't reason themselves into.
This is harsh to acknowledge. These are our neighbors, our family members, our coworkers. But pretending they'll suddenly embrace reality if we just find the right words is preventing us from protecting democracy from those who no longer live in the real world.
You cannot govern people who live in different realities.
When a third of the country believes we're being invaded by immigrants while actual border crossings dropped 81% in December 2024 compared to the previous year, how do you collaborate on immigration policy? When they believe hurricanes are God punishing gay people, how do you craft disaster preparedness plans? When they think wildfires are caused by Jewish space lasers and climate change is fake, how do you discuss evidence based environmental policy?
You don't. You just have to govern while each side responds to completely different versions of what's happening.
This isn't like normal democratic disagreements. It's not "how should we address crime?" It's "are mass shootings real or are they all transgender crisis actors?"
If we can't share reality, we need to stop pretending we can share governance.
Blue states can't effectively collaborate with red states who refuse to acknowledge basic science. Instead, we need to be building renewable energy infrastructure, funding public health, and investing in education. Meanwhile, red states are banning books about Rosa Parks, rejecting federal healthcare funds, and teaching creationism as science. They're passing laws based on conspiracy theories about litter boxes in school bathrooms.
This is the future: Two Americas, each governing according to their own version of reality.
Stop trying to convince them. No amount of facts, logic, or evidence will change minds that have already decided facts, logic, and evidence are themselves conspiracies.
Instead, do the following:
if you live in a red state, pass voting rights expansion, make it so every voice can be heard. Also, fight to have ballot initiatives that improve quality of life for your fellow residents.
If you live in a blue state then work to cut off red state welfare, improve your quality of life, and make bilateral agreements with other blue states. Create friction at every level of engagement with the federal government to counter their wild corruption, greed, and hate.
Build systems that function without them. The Federal Reserve doesn't take a vote on whether inflation exists. It measures it and responds. Every critical institution needs this same independence from democratic input when that input is based on fiction.
Let reality be the referee. Major insurers have withdrawn from Florida markets because climate change is real whether Ron DeSantis believes it or not. Businesses are leaving states that ban books and restrict healthcare because educated workers won't move there. Reality has a way of asserting itself through money.
Protect the systems that determine truth. Universities, research institutions, and government statistical agencies need constitutional protection from political interference because they threaten the alternate timeline.
We must accept that democracy has limits. We don't vote on whether gravity exists. Some things are true regardless of what people believe, and policy about those things shouldn't be subject to democratic input from people who deny they exist.
This isn't elitist. It's recognition that democracy cannot function when voters are responding to events that didn't happen, solving problems that don't exist, and fighting threats that aren't real.
Of course, not everyone who voted for Trump believes all of these things. Some only believe the election was stolen. Others only think vaccines are dangerous. Still others simply wanted lower taxes. But enough believe enough false things that we can no longer govern based on shared facts. And those who don't believe the lies but vote alongside those who do are choosing power over truth.
The 35% answer is an acknowledgement that we can't govern in two different realities. It's an acknowledgment that a third of America has chosen fantasy over reality, and the rest of us need to figure out how to build a functional society without them.
The alternative is simple: We keep pretending both realities are equally valid, keep seeking compromise between what happened and what didn't.
That's not democracy. It's a suicide pact.
Christopher Armitage
No. of Recommendations: 7
"Stop trying to convince them. No amount of facts, logic, or evidence will change minds that have already decided facts, logic, and evidence are themselves conspiracies."
I've felt that way for quite some time, basically since 1-6-2021. I did not think
the Country would elect Trump in 2024, after seeing the riot he caused on January 6th.
But the cult fantasized that riot into poor Trump, everybody is always picking on him,lol.
We will see if Trump lost any cult members in the mid terms in 2026. The cult, if hit hard
enough by Trump's bizarre economic policies, may come back to earth and realize they
need to get some restraints on him, and the only way they can do that is by swinging
the House to the D's. I am cautiously, kind of sort of, optimistic that the pendulum
will swing in 2026. But the cult will not hold Trump responsible, only his lapdog
R's underneath him. Trump is sending troops into American cities, there is at least
a decent-sized chance that he doesn't vacate office willingly in 2029.
No. of Recommendations: 19
UpNorthJoe: The cult, if hit hard enough by Trump's bizarre economic policies, may come back to earth and realize they need to get some restraints on him...
Most people in cults don't have a Joycean epiphany. No one at the Peoples Temple suddenly said, "What the f*ck, I'm not drinking that punch."
Just yesterday, republican speaker Johnson tweeted that "The grand opening of the new Rose Garden Club at the White House last night was epic," like the White House is some Club Med. For crying out loud, look at those photos: Trumpedo turned the Rose Garden into a Cheesecake Factory.
Earlier this week, Johnson claimed Trumpedo was an FBI informant.
Trumpedo Truth Socialed an AI-generated image of himself in a Cavalry hat in a mocked-up scene from Apocalypse Now. As senator Tammy Duckworth pointed out, that draft dodger didn't earn the right to wear it, and any other president would have been harshly criticized in the media for that stolen valor.
And Christ on a cracker, in Apocalypse Now the Robert Duvall character, Lt. Colonel Kilgore, is a lunatic and the film is about American failure and moral depravity during war.
Well, wait now... maybe Trumpedo does get it after all. He is a lunatic and he is spiraling America towards failure.
The trouble for the rest of us is that the cult has lost all sense of reality and keeps cheering him on.
And paying $3.59 for a gallon of gas (like I did yesterday) or $10.99 for a pound of bacon (what it cost yesterday at Mariano's) hasn't made them realize they have been bigly duped.
Because it's a freakin' cult.
No. of Recommendations: 3
And paying $3.59 for a gallon of gas (like I did yesterday) or $10.99 for a pound of bacon (what it cost yesterday at Mariano's) hasn't made them realize they have been bigly duped.
Because it's a freakin' cult.
What a crock..a gallon of gas in my conservative town is $2.99 a gallon.
A pound of bacon at the Walmart grocery store is $5.25 per pound.
Sucks to live in a Blue city, doesn’t it?
No. of Recommendations: 6
The cult, if hit hard enough by Trump's bizarre economic policies, may come back to earth and realize they
need to get some restraints on him, Trump's message is clear "Make America White Again". As I said, this is a "turn back the clock' project, to about 1910, when straight, white, men, ran everything. We heard it from Bill O'Reilly's lips, several years ago.
McCain and Bill O'Reilly on White powerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysoOB9w0tF4Arguments about facts, economics, and justice, do not have a chance.
Steve
No. of Recommendations: 6
No. of Recommendations: 3
Trump's message is clear "Make America White Again".Tell me why then....
“How Trump won over Latino and Hispanic voters in historic numbers”
SNIP
“Experts say president-elect’s bombastic attitude and economic messaging helped flip traditionally blue counties”
SNIP
“His victory, fueled largely by support from Latino and Hispanic voters, particularly Latino men, was repeated in county after county in swing states as the Democrats’ blue wall crumbled and it became clear Trump would once again be president.”
SNIP
“And among other minority groups, Arab and Muslim Americans in Michigan also seemed able to overlook Trump’s full-throated support of Israel’s military onslaught in Gaza to show up for him in large numbers.”
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/nov/09/tr...“How Trump won one-fifth of Black men and nearly half of Latino”
SNIP
“Trump doubled his standing with Black men from four years ago and secured nearly half — 47 percent — of Latino men, according to exit polling.”
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/11/07/trump-bla...
No. of Recommendations: 4
We will see if Trump lost any cult members in the mid terms in 2026. The cult, if hit hard
enough by Trump's bizarre economic policies, may come back to earth and realize they
need to get some restraints on him, and the only way they can do that is by swinging
the House to the D's. I am cautiously, kind of sort of, optimistic that the pendulum
will swing in 2026.
It may be enough if at least some of the MAGA cult are discouraged enough not to go to the polls.
But...I do not think it is hyperbolic to worry that Trump and his deeply weaponized executive branch, supported by a deeply corrupt GOP Congress might make it impossible for Dems to win a majority in either house.
And we can no longer count on the SCOTUS to protect our democracy.
No. of Recommendations: 6
A pound of bacon at the Walmart grocery store is $5.25 per pound.~LMSince Trump took office:
Bacon is up 2.9%. The combined cost of meats, poultry, fish and eggs rose by 2.8%.
Coffee prices rose by 11.3%. Dairy and related products rose slightly, by 0.5%.
Sugar and sweets rose by 3.7%.
Ground beef saw the biggest increase, rising by a whopping 11.6%!
These increases are over half a year. If these items’ prices continue to rise at the same rate over a full year, the percentage increase would double.
Ice cream hit the highest prices on record since the 1980s.
Miller Lite and Coors Light six-packs are up more than 13% at Walmart.
Imported beer prices also rose with Peroni increasing 10.5% and Modelo Especial 9.5%.
Cookout essentials like aluminum foil, grill tools, and sunscreen saw hikes between 6% and 18%.
68% of those surveyed said barbecues are noticeably more expensive to host this year with 55% noting Trump's tariffs are making holiday celebrations more expensive."
Trump lied to you...once again. You are in an abusive relationship.
{Lying is considered a form of emotional abuse because it creates confusion for the victim and manipulates their perception of reality, often used as a tactic by the abuser to gain power and control.
This consistent dishonesty increases anxiety and clouds the victim’s thinking, undermining trust and causing emotional harm. Abusive relationships are defined by negative patterns of power and control,
which can be exerted through emotional means like lying, manipulation, humiliation, and other controlling behaviors.
Therefore, persistent lying can be one of the signs that a relationship is abusive.}
Sad.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2025/sep/05/...https://www.axios.com/2025/07/03/july-4th-barbecue...
No. of Recommendations: 4
What a crock..a gallon of gas in my conservative town is $2.99 a gallon.
Ha!
liberals need to live under liberal policies.
Gas in WA state? $5 bucks a gallon in Seattle city limits.
You know who’s *really* in a cult? People who scream that everyone else is in a cult.
liberalism is a mental disorder.
No. of Recommendations: 3
Ha!
liberals need to live under liberal policies.
Many do. The so-called "blue cities" are, by definition, full of liberals. That's why it's a blue city. And, apparently, they like it. Otherwise, they have the power to change it (since they are in control in those cities).
That you don't like it is really your problem. You still have democracy in WA.
No. of Recommendations: 2
No. of Recommendations: 1
I don’t live in Milwaukee and it is a Blue city.
PW has 500+ franchises in 18-19 states, mostly Northeast and Central US. Which means they are not in a lot of major metropolitan markets. They used to be in MN, but left decades ago.
