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- Manlobbi
Halls of Shrewd'm / US Policy
No. of Recommendations: 0
Not only "Be charged by" but if the utility wants some power...it'll take it from your car.
Remember when it was an unhinged conspiracy theory to say that an all-EV fleet of vehicles would be easy for the government to decide who drives, when and how often? Good times.
https://abc7news.com/electric-vehicle-ev-pge-power...SAN FRANCISCO (KGO) -- It's been said before, California's power grid will have to expand in order to meet the demand for more energy. PG&E's CEO Patricia Poppe has come up with an "unconventional" idea, using electric cars to send excess power back to the grid to prevent blackouts.LOL. Because, you know, you don't need to go anywhere during the blackout. Say, shouldn't they planning for adding more power generation capacity?
San Diego has a pilot program with school buses using bi-directional charging that feeds into the grid at the end of the day.
"It's a gigantic unharnessed, untapped power source that can be used. Most vehicles are sitting parked, unused 95 percent of the time," added Johnson.Right, people just charge up vehicles so as to not use them 95% of the time. You can't make this stuff up.
No. of Recommendations: 0
San Diego has a pilot program with school buses using bi-directional charging that feeds into the grid at the end of the day.
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Also, wouldn't that additional non-transportation discharge into the grid amount to extra wear and tear on the battery thus requiring replacement sooner than if used solely for transportation?
No. of Recommendations: 1
Also, wouldn't that additional non-transportation discharge into the grid amount to extra wear and tear on the battery thus requiring replacement sooner than if used solely for transportation?
Indeed it does!
Not to mention all the losses from moving all the power around due to voltage conversion efficiencies + transmission line losses. They'll lose a ton of energy just shifting stuff around.
Until and unless solid state batteries hit the market (some are coming online), I won't touch an EV with a 10 foot pole.
No. of Recommendations: 3
Dope1: Remember when it was an unhinged conspiracy theory to say that an all-EV fleet of vehicles would be easy for the government to decide who drives, when and how often?
Adjust your tinfoil hat, that's not what she's talking about. Vehicle-to-home charging, or V2H, is already here. And bidirectional charging is clearly on its way, part of a broader vision for a next-generation electric grid in which millions of EVs are constantly taking power from the grid and giving it back ' a key element of an electrified future.
bighairymike: Also, wouldn't that additional non-transportation discharge into the grid amount to extra wear and tear on the battery thus requiring replacement sooner than if used solely for transportation?
V2h charging is here now but they'll never be able to figure out a way to tackle that discharge problem. Never, never, never, never, never.
Thank God you guys aren't employed in these industries.
No. of Recommendations: 1
V2h charging is here now but they'll never be able to figure out a way to tackle that discharge problem. Never, never, never, never, never. - CO
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How much uncompensated wear and tear on privately owned batteries must be endured before the inevitable solution you foresee is available? Our stampede to solar power is getting more and more ahead of our battery technology every day.
No. of Recommendations: 3
How much uncompensated wear and tear on privately owned batteries must be endured before the inevitable solution you foresee is available? Our stampede to solar power is getting more and more ahead of our battery technology every day.
He doesn't know the first thing about what you're mentioning. He's seen the F-150 Lightning commercial and thinks, "Wow, my truck can power my house!". Too bad that while it does that...your ability to drive someplace kinda goes out the window. And yes, battery packs only have so many charge/discharge cycles in them before they need to be replaced.
I'm not sure it's possible to miss the mark as much as he manages to, but there he goes...
Anyways. Solid state batteries aren't a joke:
https://www.pcmag.com/how-to/what-is-solid-state-b...Lithium ion batteries, used in EVs today, have a liquid electrolyte solution sandwiched in between their cathodes and anodes (see the middle gap in the image above). Alternatively, solid state batteries use solid electrolytes.
The increased density means solid state batteries can hold anywhere between two to 10 times the capacity of a lithium ion battery, AutoWeek reports.They're safer, too
The liquid electrolytes in lithium ion batteries are flammable, but since solid state batteries do not have that liquid, they do not run the same risk of fire.They're not perfect, though. You still need lithium, cobalt and nickel to make them and none of that stuff is exactly environmentally friendly to mine or extract. Plus a lot of it comes from some not-so-nice places. Your average box wine-swilling, EV-driving sanctimonious virtue signaler likely has zero idea that a lot of Cobalt comes from child labor in the Congo:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cobalt-children-minin...A CBS News investigation has found child labor being used in the dangerous mining of cobalt in the Democratic Republic of Congo. The mineral cobalt is used in virtually all batteries in common devices, including cellphones, laptops and even electric vehicles.
A report by Amnesty International first revealed that cobalt mined by children was ending up in products from several companies, including Apple, Microsoft, Tesla and Samsung.Lots of work goes on to try to stop the flow of conflict minerals, but there's a lot of lip service being paid to that.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/despite-refor...But unsafe, artisanal mining persists, as does child labor. In locations visited by Washington Post journalists, workers in flip-flops and torn T-shirts, including some who appeared to be teenagers, crowded into huge open pits or descended into the tunnels that honeycomb the ground. Their ore is usually bought by middlemen and smaller industrial mines, refined locally and then shipped to China, where it disappears in the opaque global supply chain.EV's aren't a panacea. The US' power grid - and especially California's - is woefully undersized and not nearly efficient enough to move all the cars from gas powered to electric power despite what Washington, D.C. and the car industry says.
No. of Recommendations: 4
I gotta say I didn't read the whole thread, but figured I would add in my two cents worth anyway:-)
CA currently generates more solar during peak periods than it can use so is trying to find ways to capture some of that output rather than just turning off some of the solar. Today, it is possible to set EV cars to charge during this peak solar time which is a bonus.
It would be nice to have additional ways to capture that peak solar but it is currently very expensive.
Having a way to use your car battery to sell power back to the power company during their peak needs would seem like quite a bonus. Of course, you could always unplug if you needed to go somewhere so I don't really see that as an issue. The bigger issue is the technology does not currently exist to do this.
Alan
No. of Recommendations: 4
bighairymike: How much uncompensated wear and tear on privately owned batteries must be endured...
None. Who says bidirectional charging would be uncompensated?
Dope1: He doesn't know the first thing about what you're mentioning. He's seen the F-150 Lightning commercial and thinks, "Wow, my truck can power my house!". Too bad that while it does that...your ability to drive someplace kinda goes out the window. And yes, battery packs only have so many charge/discharge cycles in them before they need to be replaced.
Umm, everything's projection with you, isn't it? Well, when it's not twisting someone else's words around.
In fairness, it's usually both.
Bidirectional charging with respect to the power grid is not V2H and I never implied that it was. But adoption of both bidirectional charging and V2H is on its way; not yet ready for prime time but on the way. Technologies will improve or even change, and rapidly.
And how does your ability to drive someplace go out the window? Many families have two or more cars and they're not always in use. If you don't want a car bidirectionally charging, unplug it or flip a switch to stop the connection and just keep it in charging mode.
Dope1: Your average box wine-swilling, EV-driving sanctimonious virtue signaler likely has zero idea that a lot of Cobalt comes from child labor in the Congo.
So do shoes, rice, coffee, tea, leather goods, chocolate, rugs, diamonds, gold, clothing and a whole list of other products. No one on this board isn't buying something made by child labor.
No. of Recommendations: 1
So do shoes, rice, coffee, tea, leather goods, chocolate, rugs, diamonds, gold, clothing and a whole list of other products. No one on this board isn't buying something made by child labor.
That's nice. We'll just jot you down for Nothing to See There!
Umm, everything's projection with you, isn't it?
No, I worked in the industry and have been to battery cell manufacturers in some of the not-so-nice parts of China. My knowledge exceeds your ability to google something by 4 or 5 orders of magnitude. You've made it plain in this thread that you have zero clue about any of this stuff.
No. of Recommendations: 3
No, I worked in the industry and have been to battery cell manufacturers in some of the not-so-nice parts of China. My knowledge exceeds your ability to google something by 4 or 5 orders of magnitude.
Nothing you write is credible.
