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Stocks A to Z / Stocks B / Berkshire Hathaway (BRK.A)
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Author: mungofitch 🐝🐝🐝🐝 SILVER
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Number: of 15062 
Subject: OT: Pension liabilities
Date: 07/27/2024 6:59 PM
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I was re-reading an old essay by Mr Buffett.
The one in 1999 saying forward returns would be low is well known; this 2001 follow-up is a bit less read, but still worth reading.
https://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_ar...

Incidentally, it ends with the observation that since the economy had grown since his earlier 1999 essay, and prices were lower, better forward returns could be expected. He suggested something in the vicinity of 7%/year (nominal total return) could be expected for long term returns from there. I checked how it came out: rather to my surprise, except for a few lucky end dates around 2007 when the credit boom was under way, someone buying SPY the date of the essay would have had to wait over 15 years before reaching a pre-tax annual nominal total return of 7%/year.

Anyway, the essay talks a fair bit about pension funds, and the rates of returns that are assumed, and how silly and self-serving the assumed rates had been. This led me to find this page, which is a nice snapshot of what pension funds have been assuming lately, and over time.
https://www.milliman.com/en/insight/2024-corporate...
Rather to my surprise, the assumed rates have been (except for this past year) on a near-uninterrupted slide since that millennial essay. Maybe some pension managers read the essay?

It's a good read for data geeks. See figure 16 for the evolution of assumed rates of return. It has a nice overview of the biggest DB pension funds by ticker. Berkshire's fund is not one of the largest, at only $13.4bn. Ford's is biggest, at $54.4bn. IBM and GM are comparable.

Jim

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Author: sutton   😊 😞
Number: of 15062 
Subject: Re: OT: Pension liabilities
Date: 07/30/2024 5:26 PM
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...about pension funds, and the rates of returns that are assumed, and how silly and self-serving the assumed rates had been...Rather to my surprise, the assumed rates have been (except for this past year) on a near-uninterrupted slide since that millennial essay. Maybe some pension managers read the essay? It's a good read for data geeks.

This data geek found it interesting.

I well remember both Mr Buffett and Mr Munger going on about the dangers of pension funds and their wholly unrealistic assumed rates of return -- there was even a line in one of the early-200s Annual Meetings Q&As of these assumptions and the resultant gross underfunding of the plans in the real world representing "financial weapons of mass destruction", an analogy that both Warren and Charlie subscribed to. (What I don't remember for sure is whether it was all US DB plans, or just the large public DB plans e.g. CalPERS that they were talking about.)

But the reference Jim linked indeed shows a roughly linear slide in assumed ROR from 9.4% (up to 10.9%!) in 2000 to 5.8% in 2023. And I think these numbers are all nominal (not-inflation-adjusted) which is even more impressive.

It would be an interesting followup question for the 2025 AM, I think -- particularly as regards public plans, unreferenced in Jim's link.

(FWIW: One of my sons, mid-30s, is employed by a Fortune 100 company represented in the database mungo linked. He (my son, not Jim) asked my help in crunching numbers with the DB pension plan buyout he was offered last year. The math's not the point, but what that offer reinforced to me was I think there's no sign of slowing of the disappearance of DB plans, at least in the public sector. Conversely, I recently looked up what the DB plan is for California civil service employees with the position my Dad retired from in, uh, 1984. It's effectively unchanged over the last forty years, as near as I can tell)

--sutton
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